2014 Official Draft Thread

[Mister Hoarse]

I love it when arm lengths are measured to the thousandths of an inch. Now that's precision. And a big ass micrometer.

Time watch out for this big ass micrometers

[ArtistFormerlyKnownAsBKR]

Here's some food for thought: Could it possibly be that Carmichael might just have had a little teensy bit of good technique to go with his God-given stature? I wonder why Mikhael Ricks didn't dominate...

He's not saying that. He's saying that smaller CBs couldn't handle Carmichael's size at all. Which explains why Carmichael was completely unstoppable (and not in the HOF), even though he played against divisional opponents

Dwight Hicks 6'1" 190
Roger Wehrli 6'0" 190 (Hall of Famer)
Emmitt Thomas 6'2" 192 (Hall of Famer)
Mel Renfro 6'0" 190 (Hall of Famer)

and was a contemporary of

Bobby Bryant 6'1" 170
Lester Hayes 6'0" 200 (5 time Pro Bowler)
Mike Haynes 6'2" 192 (Hall of Famer)
Ken Riley 5'11" 181
Lemar Parrish 5'11" 185 (eight time Pro Bowler)
Lem Barney 6'0" 188 (Hall of Famer)
Willie Brown 6'1" 195 (Hall of Famer)

And here are some other guys that couldn't have stopped Carmichael:

Ronde Barber 5'10" 184
Aeneas Williams 5'11" 200
Champ Bailey 6'0" 192
Deion Sanders 6'1" 195 (HOF)
Darrell Green 5'9" 184 (HOF)
Rod Woodson 5'11" 205 (HOF)

*Drops microphone*

[Yubaking]

After all of your postings last year, the issue is no longer open for debate.

I know. I was right about most of the things upon which I expressed an opinion, especially about our defense.

[sandiego17]

I know. I was right about most of the things upon which I expressed an opinion, especially about our defense.

Like Tony Montana - Always right, even when you're wrong (paraphrasing). At this point, based on my Yubamoter, I expect Verrett is a rookie of the year candidate.

[sandiego17]

Kiper 4.0



Anthony Barr

San Diego Chargers (9-7)

COLLEGE: UCLA
Class: Sr
HT: 6-4
WT: 255
POS: OLB

Analysis: I also see cornerback as a possibility here, but the Chargers need another pass-rusher and Barr fits the scheme and offers the upside of a guy I once saw as a likely top-10 pick. Barr has dropped on my board and others because his senior tape didn't live up to the production, and I think he can often be too tentative in his reads and reactions. But we're still talking about a player who has shown the ability to disrupt in the passing game and his workouts didn't really disappoint, either. He's a good value here.

(Fuller, Verrett, Ford and Nix available)

57. San Diego Chargers | *Donte Moncrief, WR, Mississippi
With the measurables of a player typically drafted much higher, Moncrief is one of the best size/speed equations in the draft, but he was inconsistent in 2013 and lands here. San Diego isn't set at WR just because Keenan Allen had a good year. The Chargers are thin behind him.

Thin at WR? Must be his hair.

[Yubaking]

He's not saying that. He's saying that smaller CBs couldn't handle Carmichael's size at all. Which explains why Carmichael was completely unstoppable (and not in the HOF), even though he played against divisional opponents

Dwight Hicks 6'1" 190
Roger Wehrli 6'0" 190 (Hall of Famer)
Emmitt Thomas 6'2" 192 (Hall of Famer)
Mel Renfro 6'0" 190 (Hall of Famer)

and was a contemporary of

Bobby Bryant 6'1" 170
Lester Hayes 6'0" 200 (5 time Pro Bowler)
Mike Haynes 6'2" 192 (Hall of Famer)
Ken Riley 5'11" 181
Lemar Parrish 5'11" 185 (eight time Pro Bowler)
Lem Barney 6'0" 188 (Hall of Famer)
Willie Brown 6'1" 195 (Hall of Famer)

And here are some other guys that couldn't have stopped Carmichael:

Ronde Barber 5'10" 184
Aeneas Williams 5'11" 200
Champ Bailey 6'0" 192
Deion Sanders 6'1" 195 (HOF)
Darrell Green 5'9" 184 (HOF)
Rod Woodson 5'11" 205 (HOF)

*Drops microphone*

Not what I said, but what else is new?

I said that CBs struggled against Carmichael due to his size and that there were plays that could not be stopped because of his size advantage regardless of what the defender did. I said that I expect Verrett to experience similar problems against today's bigger receivers.

And you are only showing your own ignorance if you think that Carmichael did not have a strong NFL career or if you think that the Eagles did not take advantage of Carmichael's height. The guy was a four time Pro Bowler and had 590 receptions playing most of his football in the much more run heavy 70s, which including many seasons (six) before the first liberalization of the passing rules in 1977 and seven seasons before the 16 game season came into play. And if he played against the great players that you mentioned in your post and still had the success that he did and the primary basis for that success was his height, I think you have gone a very long way toward proving my point about Verrett and the problems he may encounter when matched up against today's larger NFL receivers given the similar difference in length involved.

[Yubaking]

NFL.com shows him at 196 and Verrett at 189. If Revis is bigger now, I wonder if that has anything to do with physical maturity and getting into an NFL weight program? Could either of those possibly apply to Verrett?

I did not see Revis' weight listed as of the time of the draft by NFL.com, but NFL.com lists his current weight as being 198. Multiple sources, including ESPN, listed his weight at the time of the draft as being 204. Apparently, he has lost a few pounds over his career.

I think Verrett has a very small frame, so I question what additional good weight he could add as much as I question that the guy actually weighs 189 pounds. He looks closer to McCluster's size to me.

[Mister Hoarse]

Kiper 4.0



Anthony Barr

San Diego Chargers (9-7)

COLLEGE: UCLA
Class: Sr
HT: 6-4
WT: 255
POS: OLB

Analysis: I also see cornerback as a possibility here, but the Chargers need another pass-rusher and Barr fits the scheme and offers the upside of a guy I once saw as a likely top-10 pick. Barr has dropped on my board and others because his senior tape didn't live up to the production, and I think he can often be too tentative in his reads and reactions. But we're still talking about a player who has shown the ability to disrupt in the passing game and his workouts didn't really disappoint, either. He's a good value here.

(Fuller, Verrett, Ford and Nix available)

57. San Diego Chargers | *Donte Moncrief, WR, Mississippi
With the measurables of a player typically drafted much higher, Moncrief is one of the best size/speed equations in the draft, but he was inconsistent in 2013 and lands here. San Diego isn't set at WR just because Keenan Allen had a good year. The Chargers are thin behind him.

Thin at WR? Must be his hair.

Fuuuck.. Kiper read the dream scenario I posted and just prevented it from happening!

[ArtistFormerlyKnownAsBKR]

Does a difference of about one tenth of a second in the 40 matter to you? If not, then Fuller's hips are as fluid and he is probably a little better against the run and at least as good in pass coverage. He is 6'0" and his arms are longer than Verrett's by a couple of inches or so. That's the guy I would prefer at #25 if we go CB there (assuming Gilbert and Dennard are both gone).

I never said it was about Verrett's speed. Have you even seen the guy play?

[Mister Hoarse]

Hey, when are we gonna do another mock on this board? FA is basically over, for now.

[Mister Hoarse]

And which of those 5 elite CBs at the top are the best tacklers? Anyone?

[ArtistFormerlyKnownAsBKR]

Not what I said, but what else is new?

Why do you think it is that so many posters struggle to understand "what you said?"

I said that CBs struggled against Carmichael due to his size and that there were plays that could not be stopped because of his size advantage regardless of what the defender did.

Unless I'm totally misunderstanding you yet again, you're saying that on some plays Carmichael had an advantage bc of his height. Which through logical deduction means the rest of the plays it didn't matter so much. And by implication, that maybe there were some plays that defenders (even smaller ones, since well, they all were) had some sort of advantage. Gee, it sounds like competitive football to me. But then again, it's very hard for a moron like me to follow your high-level thinking.

And you are only showing your own ignorance if you think that Carmichael did not have a strong NFL career or if you think that the Eagles did not take advantage of Carmichael's height. The guy was a four time Pro Bowler and had 590 receptions playing most of his football in the much more run heavy 70s, which including many seasons (six) before the first liberalization of the passing rules in 1977 and seven seasons before the 16 game season came into play.

I never said anything negative about Carmichael. I don't need you to tell me about his career. I watched him play. A lot.

And if he played against the great players that you mentioned in your post and still had the success that he did and the primary basis for that success was his height, I think you have gone a very long way toward proving my point about Verrett and the problems he may encounter when matched up against today's larger NFL receivers given the similar difference in length involved.

He had success, yes. But per usual the only side you are capable of seeing is the one you are so desperate to prove but which facts do not support. Yes, he had success. Even against against some great players. But he didn't totally own them. All Pro players and very good players won their share of battles against him. Your logical exercise (which is all it is and all you ever do) ignores this.

Your argument basically now is a gutted shell of what it was. You're reduced to "on some plays" bigger receivers will have the advantage because of height. As I said previously, all things being equal I would prefer a taller defender. But all things aren't equal. Depending on who else is available when we pick, I could be very happy that we select Verrett at 25. And I would be happy knowing that on "some plays" he will be at a disadvantage.