2014 Official Draft Thread

[Beerman]

Steve has said it quite a few times, but it bears repeating. Our DEs have the responsibility of occupying blockers and staying in their gaps. It's when they freelance and get out of position that bad things happen.

Both of our DEs love penetrating though and it's not always the right call.

[ArtistFormerlyKnownAsBKR]

I think Donald is the most overhyped player in the draft. I have not heard one negative thing said about him and that he is the star of the combine day or the star of Senior Bowl week. And yet, he is an undersized 4-3 DT that will have to win matchups with quickness. I see him as much more of a bust candidate than Clowney based upon physical attributes. Clowney's issues appear to be mostly mental. If he is capable of maintaining a consistent focus, he should end up as the much better player.

People have been all over Clowney as we approach the draft. He has been criticized for electing not to do certain drills, which he plans to do at his pro day. He has been criticized for not going crazy when Dee Ford suggested that he is better than Clowney, which is so idiotic that all Clowney could do was laugh at the remarks made by Ford. He has been criticized for being unmotivated and being inconsistent on the field. He has been criticized for his lack of work ethic. All I have heard is criticism about Clowney notwithstanding the fact that he posted top 3 results for front 7 players in the 40, the broad jump and vertical leap, which shows that he is arguably the most explosive front 7 player in the draft.

Further, Donald is 4 inches shorter than Clowney, which should be an advantage over him in the 40 in terms of producing a quicker start. Clowney ran as fast as Mike Evans and faster than Kelvin Benjamin, WRs of similar height, and outweighs them by 35 and 26 pounds, respectively. Hopefully, that puts his amazing 40 time into better perspective.

I am hopeful that we would not even think about drafting Donald until day 3 of the draft (where hopefully he will be long gone). He has bust potential and he is a god-awful fit for our defense. The last thing we need is another speed/finesse 4-3 DT that gets blown off the line or completely controlled by bigger, longer armed OL players playing on a line in a real game and not isolated in some one on one practice drill. We need a double team commanding presence in the middle of DL to help free up our OLBs and ILBs to make plays and that isn't Donald.

How did I miss this one???

[ArtistFormerlyKnownAsBKR]

If yuba says something, you can pretty much take it to the bank that it's the other way around. Which in a way is kinda cool.

LOL, yes, something comforting in that.

[Boltjolt]

While I love Aaron Donald and think he's one of the 8 best football players period in this draft, the scheme fit does matter. Shea McClellin was a good football player miscast in the Bears 4-3 and is now going to finally be moved to LB where he should have played from the beginning. Donald is ideal for someone like the Bears at 14 even over Jernigan. I think he's the best 3-technique in this draft class and an absolute stud.

I'm disappointed we didn't get to see Dee Ford today...he's someone I definitely want evaluated for the Chargers at 25. Kony Ealy looked good, but didn't jump out during the drills the way Aldon Smith did a few years back.

Ealy's numbers were horrible except for his 3 cone. Slow 40, not a good vert or long jump. No explosion there. Still think he is a DE in a 4-3. Ford is just strictly a pass rusher imo...like Barnes who wasnt anything against the run to speak of.

Agree Donald is just a football player and you have to love those guys. But as a OLB, i like Attaochu and Jeffcoat in the 2nd....have some interest in Chris Smith but i think he is more a 3rd. Hopefully Telesco can find a good one.

[bonehead]

How I see things shaping up and the players that likely go before we pick.

QBs (3) - Manziel, Bridgewater, Bortles,
OT (4) - Robinson, Matthews, Lewan, Martin
WR (4) Watkins, Evans, Benjamin, Lee
TE - Ebron

ILB - Mosley
OLB (3)- Barr, Clowney, Mack
DT (3) - Donald, Jernigan, Nix
CB (3) - Denard, Jerrett, Gilbert
S (2)- Clinton Dix, Pryor


Here are 24 players I think go before our pick. Ideally one of the guys we need drop. Another QB can easily move up, so can some WRs if there's an early run on them.

In an ideal world we can get a pass rusher or one of the big DTs. I don't see it happening in the first. We end up with Brandon Cooks.

In that scenario Hageman, Ealy and Dee Ford would also be available ..... We could take one of them or Cooks but I would hope for a trade partner at the top of the second, Jags, Skins, browns etc,,,a lot of talent would be there and we could pick up an extra 3rd rounder

[Beerman]

Dee Ford is a guy that can potentially grade out as a first rounder and our likely only chance at an OLB in the first IMO. He'll never be a SOLB for us, but brings that speed element that we lack on the weak side. Ingram is better suited to take over for JJ IMO anyways since he's pretty stout over there and can drop back fairly decently.

We are sorely lacking that speed element in our front line though. Ideally Ford has the frame to bulk up to 250 kinda like Von Miller did (who was awful in run D his rookie year too).

[Beerman]

In that scenario Hageman, Ealy and Dee Ford would also be available ..... We could take one of them or Cooks but I would hope for a trade partner at the top of the second, Jags, Skins, browns etc,,,a lot of talent would be there and we could pick up an extra 3rd rounder

Indeed, I just don't know how those guys will grade out for Telesco or fit the scheme.

[Stinky Wizzleteats+]

Dee Ford is a guy that can potentially grade out as a first rounder and our likely only chance at an OLB in the first IMO. He'll never be a SOLB for us, but brings that speed element that we lack on the weak side. Ingram is better suited to take over for JJ IMO anyways since he's pretty stout over there and can drop back fairly decently.

We are sorely lacking that speed element in our front line though. Ideally Ford has the frame to bulk up to 250 kinda like Von Miller did (who was awful in run D his rookie year too).

Dee Ford has a disk issue in his spine and was not allowed to participate. Could be a medical red flag.

Do you want a pass rusher rookie with back issies pre draft???

[Formula 21]

How I see things shaping up and the players that likely go before we pick.

QBs (3) - Manziel, Bridgewater, Bortles,
OT (4) - Robinson, Matthews, Lewan, Martin
WR (4) Watkins, Evans, Benjamin, Lee
TE - Ebron

ILB - Mosley
OLB (3)- Barr, Clowney, Mack
DT (3) - Donald, Jernigan, Nix
CB (3) - Denard, Jerrett, Gilbert
S (2)- Clinton Dix, Pryor


Here are 24 players I think go before our pick. Ideally one of the guys we need drop. Another QB can easily move up, so can some WRs if there's an early run on them.

In an ideal world we can get a pass rusher or one of the big DTs. I don't see it happening in the first. We end up with Brandon Cooks.

Cooks would make this O explosive. Small, but doesn't get hurt. Speed, quickness, this man brings the misssing element to this team.

[Beerman]

Dee Ford has a disk issue in his spine and was not allowed to participate. Could be a medical red flag.

Do you want a pass rusher rookie with back issies pre draft???

Dee Ford said medicals flagged a 2011 procedure for a herniated disc in lower back. Not major but advised not to compete.

He already had the surgery. It's a non issue. It's the same thing that happened with Star last year.

[Beerman]

Cooks would make this O explosive. Small, but doesn't get hurt. Speed, quickness, this man brings the misssing element to this team.

I just hope he doesn't climb past 25. I just see him as the best value based on our draft position based on who I think will be there. He fits our short passing game incredibly.

If we can't beef up the D, take the O to a new level. Also based on Telesco's comments about adding speed (which he also mentioned last year at this time needing playmakers), I think he may be a viable option.

[Steve]

Steve, you hold on! I do not see him especialy, or ant draft prospect in this draft as a plug and play 3/4 NT. That said if you can get Donald at 25 you find a way to max his current abilities and develope his long term potential. He may never be a 3/4 NT. He might a great 3 down plater early on though and a great rotation player right away at DE. Looking at the results of our DE's, one could make an argument we ask them to penetrate rather then engadge blockers if so is Donald not a good fit already?

I agree with favoring a 4/3 if we draft him, especialy becuase of Freeney and how the two can push help eachother.

I don't think we let Freeney figure into the mix. He is not a long term answer.

The key thing is how do you play a 34 D AND let the DL penetrate? This is something coaches have struggled with for a long time. Back in the late 80's, early 90's all but 3 teams had switched to the 34 from the traditional 43. Then suddenly all of them started to switch back. And there were a ton of coaches who pointed out that you couldn't rush the passer from the 30 front unless you had elite personnel. And if you had elite personnel, you could rush the passer more consistently if you played a 43. That is when every 34 that only played 30 fronts started to mix up their pass rush line and play the 40 fronts (many had already been doing it). So, now, even a 34 team plays some of both, although 43 teams just play 43 concepts.

Stinky, you seem to have given this some thought, and I wasn't just mentioning you. But the thing is that a lot of people look at guys like Donald and drool. Unlike most people, you seem to be OK with using him as a role player. I am too. But remember that coaches feel pressure too, and often they have trouble using a guy like Donald in the role they intend, especially if it works well. And if it doesn't work well, a lot of coaches tend to give up quickly.

the real question in this draft has nothing to do with the players we could pick, but with the DL we have. How long can we afford to wait and develop Liuget and Reyes? When they play well, our D is pretty good. When they don't, we tend to struggle. I'm not ready to give up on them, but clearly they are the key to the D. And at what point do we draft another player to take reps away from them? I don't know the answer to that.